Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 8:59 AM): Hello, have I got my time zones straight? :)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 8:59 AM): It's Monday. We're open for business!

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 8:59 AM): Yes, you do!

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 8:59 AM): Good morning, Rob!

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 8:59 AM): Entered the room.

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:00 AM): Is this a perl script chat? I wanted to check to see if it crashed my computer. :)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:00 AM): Hi Dawn. We're a tad early, and some lurkers usually watch....

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:00 AM): Hi all. Sorry for the confusion earlier. I had yet to make my coffee.

Weber jajagroup.com (9/24/2001 9:00 AM): Entered the room.

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:00 AM): I was thinking I'd probably want to lurk, but I can never keep my mouth shut.

John Charlesworth (BellaCoola.com) (9/24/2001 9:00 AM): Entered the room.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:00 AM): No, Dawn, this is an HTML chat -- a really kind program I had specially written so that it wouldn't crash any browsers.

Weber jajagroup.com (9/24/2001 9:01 AM): Hi Rob! I want to thank you for the American Flag link. I did not see it as self promotion. We placed that link proudly on all our sites.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:01 AM): Ben, first rule is that you have to make your coffee FIRST, THEN log on!

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:01 AM): Thanks Weber,...Now that we're alone, you'll NEVER guess who busted me for that.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:02 AM): Thanks, Rob. I'm settling in here... might take me a little. But I should have known that one. =)

Weber jajagroup.com (9/24/2001 9:02 AM): Who?

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:02 AM): John Audette...I think he was just really emotionally overwrought....

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:03 AM): Ben, you want to jump in first?

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:03 AM): Wow ... no kidding? I'm surprised he'd react like that, Rob.

Del (9/24/2001 9:03 AM): Entered the room.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:03 AM): Me too, Dawn. But I think that given all his list issues, he's just frayed.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:04 AM): Depends on what I'm jumping in with... keep in mind I'm the new kid in kindergarten here...

Weber jajagroup.com (9/24/2001 9:04 AM): I agree. I think you were practicing what is called profitable philanthropy. And there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with that.

Weber jajagroup.com (9/24/2001 9:04 AM): Everyone benefits with that.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:04 AM): Ben, we always let the "new kids" on the swing set first.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:04 AM): Did any special issue bring you here today?

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:05 AM): I had been getting business over the web for a while, and my source has recently dried up. I had a client tell me about this list awhile ago, and figured I'd give it a spin. I dig it so far.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:06 AM): Cool. Well, does anyone have any particular issue they want to toss out today? Ben, you want to let me know how I can help you?

Anne M (9/24/2001 9:07 AM): Entered the room.

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:07 AM): I do. :)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:07 AM): okay Dawn, you go.

John McCumber-Virtumundo.com (9/24/2001 9:07 AM): Entered the room.

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:08 AM): I'm having a real uphill slog trying to differentiate Wahmpreneur, partly because of the name and partly because of the WAHM stereotype.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:08 AM): Ladies first. =)

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:08 AM): At this point, I really have too much invested in the name to willingly change it, so I need to come up with something else.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:08 AM): For those of you who don't know -- and this is part of the problem, I'm sure -- WAHM is Work At Home Mothers

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:08 AM): You a real gentleman, Ben. :)

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:09 AM): I wasn't aware of that (the WAHM thing... I knew I was a gentleman - just kiddin')

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:09 AM): That's almost exactly the problem. For one thing, there are too many publications online that call themselves news that aren't.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:09 AM): Seems like a challenge. I even have questions about the correct pronunciation...

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:10 AM): Dawn, I'm sure that aurally, WAHMprenuer sounds like WHOMP-preneur. That's one problem. Another is just that your brand name is totally non-communicative -- and that's a violation of Frankel's First Law:

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:10 AM): So calling my publication Wahmpreneur News Magazine doesn't really convey that it's a real news publication.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:11 AM): "Brands are for THEM, not you." YOU know what you brand is about; THEY don't. So only insiders know what that acronym means, and so newcomers run up against a brick wall when they are first introduced to it.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:11 AM): So just to catch me up here, the name of your biz is WHAMPreneur, and you have a publication called the Wahmpreneur News Magazine. Correct?

John Charlesworth (BellaCoola.com) (9/24/2001 9:11 AM): Dawn, I may jumping the gun here, but if you chose a new name, you could have both new *and* old domain names pointing at your site. Any existing marketing (for Wahmpreneurs.com) would still take people to your site.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:12 AM): Didn't mean to have that cap "p" in there...

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:12 AM): Dawn, growth comes from the outside in, so you have to make your brand as accessible as possible. And your name is a big part of that

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:12 AM): My primary publication is called Wahmpreneur News Magazine

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:13 AM): I was afraid of that ... I'm going to have to re-name this thing, aren't I? :P

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:13 AM): IF you were a client, I would strongly advise you to consider a new name, but working it in slowly as you grow. Your business is still young enough to handle it and the better results you get will help you grow faster.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:13 AM): How many issues deep are we?

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:14 AM): I had been trying to avoid that ... long and painful history with this name. I'm up to Vol. 3, No. 4, Ben.

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:14 AM): Oh well ... no pain, no gain. :)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:14 AM): Dawn, let's not get sloppy here. No tears, soldier. If you fix it now, you'll grow much faster -- and it's a whole lot cheaper than doing it later.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:14 AM): Why not try a new name based on your old one... sort of an "off-shoot" type thing...

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:14 AM): Dawn, you have to think bigger than that. This is only a magazine. Think about all the other products and services that you can/will offer.

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:14 AM): LOL Yes, sir, captain, sir!

John Charlesworth (BellaCoola.com) (9/24/2001 9:15 AM): Dawn, is this a *printed* magazine? or an online mag?

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:15 AM): Already do ... as I'm branching off into book publishing. I get your point, Rob. I'm not going to get anywhere if I don't change this, because of the assumptions that people make from the name.

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:15 AM): Online, John.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:16 AM): Also, Dawn -- and this is important -- the more articulate your brand, the easier it is for your users o evangelize your brand, and that's key.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:16 AM): Right, Dawn, and I think your market is a wonderful one -- really huge and waiting to explode. Do it right.

Jeremy Weiss (skinnypenny.com) (9/24/2001 9:16 AM): Entered the room.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:16 AM): Ben, want to jump in now?

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:17 AM): I'm going to have to give this some thought. Thanks, guys.

Anne M (9/24/2001 9:17 AM): Entered the room.

Del (9/24/2001 9:18 AM): Dawn: Wahmpreneur News Magazine doesn't really convey anything. You could change the newsletter name and add a tagline along the likes of "The Journal for Work-At-Home Mothers".

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:18 AM): Dawn, if it helps, <PLUG> this is where my tapes come in handy </PLUG>

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:18 AM): Entered the room.

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:18 AM): [morning all]

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:18 AM): Ben?

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:19 AM): Hmmm... I guess I'm just having trouble narrowing down what I want to do with my biz. I've got a million ideas, only 24 hours in a day, and a budget that's seen better days. Like I said, most of my business comes from clients over the Web, and now I'm looking at buffing up my local presence.

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:19 AM): LOL Gotta love those PLUGs.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:19 AM): Gotta PLUG those tapes!

Weber jajagroup.com (9/24/2001 9:19 AM): Hi Del. You're gettin good.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:20 AM): What's your main gig, Ben?

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:20 AM): Ben, you're suffering from typical entrepreneur's syndrome: we have so many great ideas, but never get to focus on any one of them.

azreporter.com (Arizona Reporter) (9/24/2001 9:20 AM): Entered the room.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:21 AM): 70% of my business comes from small business' print design. The other remaining is built of web design and smaller projects.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:21 AM): I know this sounds painful -- because it can be -- but you've got to funnel all your efforts into ONE leading gig.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:21 AM): And I'm bad anyway... I've always been the kind of guy that has a good idea, dives into it, and then a day later, get a better idea and let the first one dwindle...

Anne M (9/24/2001 9:21 AM): Hi folks. I hope I'm not speaking out of turn. I have been planning to launch a website under a name relating to marketing strategy for some time, but today Rob's message about using your own name as a brand finally hit me. As a result, I have asked my web designer to put things on hold until I make the decision. So what say ye? My name dot-com or a name like "key strategist" dot-com? And why?

Del (9/24/2001 9:22 AM): Weber: "getting" good? ;-)

Weber jajagroup.com (9/24/2001 9:22 AM): Hey James

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:22 AM): Ben, small business will probably come through all this better than most, since they have lower overheads. The thing to do is start pro-actively hitting them with the message that outsourcing is still more cost-efficient and that you'll work with them during these tough times.

azreporter.com (Arizona Reporter) (9/24/2001 9:23 AM): Good morning from AZ, Weber!

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:23 AM): Ben, you can see that too many ideas will kill you! Can I suggest the "Is he/she still beautiful the morning after" strategy

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:23 AM): Anne, hold on a sec. You're next

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:23 AM): I sent out a mailing last week with the angle that the downed economy is a great time to turn your attention inwards to your own company, and I can help get their design materials and business image up to par to get them through. I think you read my mind...

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:24 AM): I can't wait to hear that one, Rob. Shoot.

Anne M (9/24/2001 9:24 AM): Ben, in case it helps, trying to focus on no more than 3 projects at a time has helped me reach various goals. I too tend to have more ideas than I can realize. This keeps me focused, but not bored.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:25 AM): Ben, when you have another idea, don't do ANYTHING with it, other than writing it down in an IDEA file. Then wait a day or so and go back to re-read it to see if it's really as good as you thought it was.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:25 AM): Plus, I've got my newsletter starting first week of October, and the subject of the whole piece is very similar to what you've just said.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:25 AM): A lot of times, the REAL reason we keep generating ideas is that we're not satisfied with how our current ideas are performing.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:25 AM): You're way better off brainstorming on how to make your current brand strategy work better.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:26 AM): That way, you're not constantly starting over.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:26 AM): That sounds good. As strange as it seems, I don't have an organized file of ideas (although I have tons of yellow lined pads with all kinds of various sketches and comments on them).

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:27 AM): Ben, also realize that most newsletters are feel good pieces that clients rarely read. I mean "feel good" for you, because it makes you think you're doing something.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:28 AM): You're way better off developing something that they will utilize and attribute directly to you. In my case, it's FrankelBiz and to a lesser extent because it's new, FrankelTips

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:28 AM): FrankelBiz actively provides people with real business opps, not just talking about it. It gets inside people's heads much more effectively than a newsletter does.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:29 AM): Which is why FrankelTips has only a fraction of the subscribers of FrankelBiz.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:29 AM): Hmmm... I figured I'd try the online version for a few issues, check the resulting feedback, and then analyzing whether I should carry on or not. It's certainly not a major undertaking of any kind...

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:30 AM): That's starting to get the gears in my head rolling...

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:30 AM): So be careful with your expectations from a newsletter. I think you'd be much better off with a personalized mass e-mail to your client base offering ways you can help each of them. Spend time building the database. it's worth it.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:30 AM): Ben, rolling your gears is what I do best. Now you know what I do for a living....!

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:30 AM): Anne, you want to jump in now?

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:32 AM): Awesome. Thanks a million.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:32 AM): No prob, Ben. Tell your friends!

Anne M (9/24/2001 9:32 AM): Yep, thanks. As I mentioned, I was planning to focus on a domain name relating to my specialty, rather than on my name itself. I will be selling informational products about marketing strategy and, ultimately, my services as a strategist. (I'm better with other people's businesses than my own--promise!)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:32 AM): Anne, you with us?

Del (9/24/2001 9:34 AM): Anne: Most people are. More attuned to seeing and helping others overcome problems then their own. Myself included. :-)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:34 AM): Well, that's the Frankel DIY Corollary: "Doing it yourself works for suicide, but not much else". An outside perspective is how you build the best brand's too.

Anne M (9/24/2001 9:34 AM): What I worried was that people might not find my site if it were a clever name and not my own, and how can I build a brand that way? (That's the point, right?)

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:35 AM): I personally don't find too much of a problem these days with domains that aren't exactly the name of the company. Especially in the creative field, if they're chosen well, creative domains tend to stick out a bit more... do you have a few in mind?

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:35 AM): Anne, I'm a big believer in using your own name, for a number of reasons:

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:35 AM): I figured Rob might disagree with me. =)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:36 AM): I mean, I do that branding thing, but my site is RobFrankel.com, because that's the ONE aspect that nobody else can purloin or rip off. More importantly, it lets them know they can work with DA MAN.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:36 AM): Although it tends to waver a bit when the name of the business is your own name, I suppose.

Anne M (9/24/2001 9:36 AM): I have a few names that passed the test, so to speak, and I thought I was happy with the name ... but it's now the Big Day, and I fear not using my own name will be a big mistake.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:36 AM): That's not to say that you won't get to my site via brandingexpert.com, misterbranding.com or any one of a dozen other domains that point to my site.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:37 AM): Actually Rob. I had a marketing professor in college who's name is Rob Frankel. I swear. ;)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:37 AM): At the end of the day, Anne, it's YOU they hire. And when it comes to speaking engagements, articles, books and after products -- did I mention my tapes <G> -- it's you they buy.

Del (9/24/2001 9:37 AM): Rob: except for frankel.com

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:38 AM): Ben, I'm actually collecting Rob Frankels.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:38 AM): Plus, without ever paying anyone, my keywords and content have been good enough to get me listed on Google's top ten in the past.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:39 AM): I though you might be him when my client first told me about this site, until I saw your pic.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:39 AM): Oh no, Ben, I'm SO MUCH BETTER LOOKING!!!!

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:39 AM): *raising hand to put question in queue*

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:40 AM): I didn't want to seem too forward, Rob. We just met. =)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:40 AM): So Anne, I'd stay the course and make it focus on you. It builds trust much faster, as people have less to wade through to get to the heart and soul of your brand.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:40 AM): Jonathan, you're next. Anne, does that make sense?

Anne M (9/24/2001 9:41 AM): Oh hell, I didn't need much convincing, I suppose. :) But I came up with this decision on the fly about 45 minutes ago and set it into action, then second-guessed my decision.

Anne M (9/24/2001 9:42 AM): Thanks so much for your help!

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:42 AM): (BEN: Interesting fact = in all my years on the web, I've had exactly ONE female send me a fan letter with an attached picture. THAT'S what a lady killer I am)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:42 AM): Jonathan, you're up!

Del (9/24/2001 9:42 AM): Mom's don't count. :p

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 9:42 AM): Now I know the REAL reason why you do all this, Rob. ;-D

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:42 AM): Hi Rob. I was wondering what you think of Google's Adwords...I am still working on my copywriting site and I was contemplating using three or four targeted ads (hard sell, soft sell, and so on) - then using gateway pages to present content tailored to each approach.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:43 AM): Can't get a date any other way. Hey, you do what works -- or doesn't......

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:43 AM): What's Google charging you, Jonathan?

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:44 AM): argh - I don't have that information at my fingertips, Rob - checking now

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:45 AM): $15/12/10/8 per thousand, depending on position

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:45 AM): Well, as you know, I try to NEVER spend anything on paid services to illustrate the value of branding tactics alone. I'm NOT suggesting that you do that, but I do want to stress that there are no really quick solutions here.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:46 AM): I'll tell you what really does work, though.....

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:46 AM): okay...

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:46 AM): Jonathan, I have a client who's specialty is search engine optimization. When I met him, I held a stereotype for those types of consultants, but this guy's really down to earth. He'd probably be willing to throw a little advice your way, if you tell him I sent you...

Del (9/24/2001 9:46 AM): I use Google all the time and have never clicked an ad/sponsor. dunno if I'm the norm though.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:47 AM): Sorry for butchering the spelling of your name, there, Jon...

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:47 AM): Ben - thanks

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:47 AM): First, if your site is optimized, you're way ahead of the game. make sure that's all set. Then -- I kid you not -- start harvesting and gathering QUALIFIED e-mail addresses

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:48 AM): DON'T SPAM. Spamming does nobody any good. But you can write them a great letter. And you'd be amazed at the response you get.

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:48 AM): Rob - from what sources? Going to other Web sites and finding the appropriate contact people/addresses?

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:49 AM): Rob: Can I post the URL for that guy's site? Is that within the rules here?

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:49 AM): (Ben - I've seen upwards of 10 misspellings of my name - as long as they get the domain name right, I'm fine with it :) )

Del (9/24/2001 9:49 AM): As far as paid-inclusion, I highly-recommend Inktomi and Looksmart.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:50 AM): Yup. The difference between spam and non spa boils down to this: 1. If they have a Contact address listed, it's okay to use it. 2. Be really low key in the letter. Personalize it and just make an introduction. I wrote a whole FrankelTips issue on how to do this. <PLUG>

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:50 AM): Sure, post the URL Ben.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:50 AM): (TEN MINUTE WARNING)

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:50 AM): Jon: If you're looking local, try searching for local business publications. We've got the Triangle Business Journal here in NC and they publish the Book of Lists yearly, which is a priceless source for contacts...

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:51 AM): His business is called Web Guerrilla and it's at www.webguerrilla.com.

Weber jajagroup.com (9/24/2001 9:51 AM): Rob, I would add to that to be careful about the subject line

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:52 AM): Jonathan, in no time at all, if you really do it right, you'll put together a list of a few hundred potential contacts. I'll bet you get at least a 2% to 5% response from them.

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:52 AM): Ben - I'm trying to do things as virtually as possible, actually; I find that in-person meetings are a lot more time-consuming than virtual ones.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:52 AM): Absolutely, Weber. I discuss that in my article.

Del (9/24/2001 9:52 AM): eww. Shockwave front? never gonna bother.

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:52 AM): thanks Ben.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:53 AM): Greg Boser? Ha ha! I knew Greg from before he even KENW there was a web!

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:53 AM): Jonathan, I agree with you. The purpose of my site is to bringing the qualified leads, and screen out the bad ones.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:54 AM): Greg Boser = webguerilla

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:54 AM): great - thanks for the advice (all of you) :)

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:54 AM): You know Greg, Rob? Good or bad? Am I walking on eggshells here? =)

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:55 AM): Ben, I've never used Greg, but that doesn't mean anything. He calls to propose projects and then I never hear from him again.

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 9:55 AM): Hmmm... that's not good. He's always been pretty responsive with me in the past.

Del (9/24/2001 9:55 AM): IF the webguerilla site is supposed to be about how to really make use of the web..design, positioning, etc, someone might want to tell him about what percentage of internet users utilize plug-ins, namely Shockwave.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:56 AM): Jonathan, I was going to say that I don't believe that adwords -- or most advertising on the web -- really leverages the web to work well. My PillowMail site does it right, IMHO. It's quasi-adult oriented, but it shows you how the advertising dynamics should and do work on the web.

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 9:56 AM): Del - it's possible he's using a detection script

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:57 AM): Well, there's a whole other FrankelTips article about the effectiveness of a technology that is usually accompanied by a "Skip Intro" link....

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:57 AM): (TWO MINUTES)

Del (9/24/2001 9:58 AM): Jonathan. He's not.

John Charlesworth (BellaCoola.com) (9/24/2001 9:58 AM): Jon, just checked--no detection script.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 9:59 AM): Okie doke, folks...really neat session today. Lots of helpful stuff. Any last shots?

Dawn Rivers Baker (9/24/2001 10:00 AM): Thanks for your help, Rob. You're my hero. :)

Ben Woodward - perpetuainteractive.com (9/24/2001 10:00 AM): Good meeting everyone. Look forward to next week's session.

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 10:00 AM): Go get 'em Dawn!

RobFrankel (Rob@RobFrankel.com) (9/24/2001 10:00 AM): Let's get out there and make the difference! I'll see you online!

John Charlesworth (BellaCoola.com) (9/24/2001 10:00 AM): See ya next week folks!

Weber jajagroup.com (9/24/2001 10:00 AM): Thanks Rob.

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 10:01 AM): thanks rob

Jonathan Cohen (Damn fine Writing) (9/24/2001 10:05 AM): ...the silence of the post-clinic...